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Braveheart

Postby Nickaberdeen » Jun Wed 19, 2019 9:42 am

So i have been puttingvthis cover off for a very long time (possibly too long) but i think it is finally time to get it done. obviously this is an important cover for me so i hope everyone will not be shy about anything they think will help improve it. and so i will begin...

i am only just getting started, so i have picked the image i liked most for the front and masked out the background:

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i'll be honest, i have no idea the direction i am going to take with this. i ideally would love to add the battle paint to this image but not sure if i will be able to pull that off so for now i will focus on figuring out a background and layout before looking into it more.
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Re: Braveheart

Postby chouette » Jun Wed 19, 2019 3:39 pm

A bit hard to give feedback with just an image, lol - But you seem to have done a good job at masking out the background. It's not really clear to me if the image is of good quality, but I'm assuming it is.

:D
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Re: Braveheart

Postby Nickaberdeen » Jun Wed 19, 2019 3:42 pm

so it turns out i wasnt really feeling that image. so have gone a different way...

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Re: Braveheart

Postby Nickaberdeen » Jun Wed 19, 2019 4:23 pm

so i have added cast, title and tagline as well as darkened mel a little.



just have to consider how to continue the image onto the rest of the cover.  :D

not too sure about the tagline font/colour/position but will contemplate that too.
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Re: Braveheart

Postby ctaulbee » Jun Wed 19, 2019 4:30 pm

He looks like he is floating in the air, due to his vanishing point being a lot higher than that of the background image, which is very low.
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Re: Braveheart

Postby Nickaberdeen » Jun Wed 19, 2019 4:35 pm

ctaulbee wrote:due to his vanishing point being a lot higher than that of the background image, which is very low.


i dont really know what that means. do you think i shoould lower the image so his feet are in line with the bottom of the cover?
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Re: Braveheart

Postby ctaulbee » Jun Wed 19, 2019 4:46 pm

Composition of images is hard when they are full scenes.

It's not like putting a image on a textured background for example where things like vanishing point don't matter, when two or more images are involved then the eye will notice if the perspectives and angles are off in relation to each other and how they are originally taken determines if they will work together or not.

It's gonna be hard if not impossible to make those two work as you have them, they were taken at different camera angles.

His from a low position looking up, you can tell by his perspective which make his vanishing point very low.

The background is near straight on and the vanishing point for it is the horizon line.

Means the background needs to come up a lot higher like the horizon needs to be above his waist at least, without having the layers and being able to draw some alignment lines I can only guess by eye.


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Re: Braveheart

Postby Nickaberdeen » Jun Wed 19, 2019 6:00 pm

oh okay. as in the people that made that poster didnt do it right? i could try masking out the background but i assume i would struggle to find an alternate background that is at the correct angle. i could possibly go back to my original imgage, just quite liked that one.
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Re: Braveheart

Postby chouette » Jun Wed 19, 2019 6:29 pm

That is an amazing video CT. A person can learn a lot of good Photoshop skills with this one. I understood what he was saying, and it made so much sense. I'm just not sure I would be quite there to master it (or have the patience for it, lol). So good luck with that Nick!

:giggle:
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Re: Braveheart

Postby Sarge » Jun Wed 19, 2019 7:53 pm

My question is this, the Tartan colors were not available, they came 200 years later, as also did the Kilt.  It is a great movie though.
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Re: Braveheart

Postby Nickaberdeen » Jun Wed 19, 2019 8:00 pm

Sarge wrote:My question is this, the Tartan colors were not available, they came 200 years later, as also did the Kilt.  It is a great movie though.


so what was the question? LOL
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Re: Braveheart

Postby ctaulbee » Jun Wed 19, 2019 9:04 pm

Nickaberdeen wrote:oh okay. as in the people that made that poster didnt do it right? i could try masking out the background but i assume i would struggle to find an alternate background that is at the correct angle. i could possibly go back to my original imgage, just quite liked that one.


Yeah, he looks like a giant lol, I see goofs all the time on studio stuff, just becasue the guy or gal is paid by Disney or FOX does not elevate their IQ or make them good at what they do or even correct for that matter.

Have you seen terrible made "B" movies, same deal, those are often made by people with experience and even degrees in film-making and still the final product is crap.

I had that discussion not long ago with someone on a different site about how just becasue someone has been doing something for years does not make them a expert or even good at it for that matter.

His contention was that someone with experience was automatically qualified to give advice, I was like not really. I've fired some engineers and programmers with years of experience and impressive resumes simply becasue they were useless at doing their jobs. It's like having a university degree it means nothing if you can't "apply" what you learned.

I've declined to hire some pretty impressively educated people too, simply becasue they could not impress me with any level of "understanding", quoting facts does not impress me, I was like yeah I read that book too, now how would you use that in the real world? ---blank look--- okay thanks for coming in for the interview, we will let you know if we need to talk to you again...
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Re: Braveheart

Postby Nickaberdeen » Jun Wed 19, 2019 9:30 pm

i always thought official artwork would have some sort of scrutiny involved and maybe some kind of quality checks before being approved. i know there is plenty of ugly artwork but i would always have expected it to be accurate. anyway i guess it doesnt really matter at the end of the day, i will figure a way to change it. thanks
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Re: Braveheart

Postby chouette » Jun Wed 19, 2019 9:36 pm

Nickaberdeen wrote:
Sarge wrote:My question is this, the Tartan colors were not available, they came 200 years later, as also did the Kilt.  It is a great movie though.


so what was the question? LOL


:lol:
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Re: Braveheart

Postby ctaulbee » Jun Wed 19, 2019 9:57 pm

Nickaberdeen wrote:i always thought official artwork would have some sort of scrutiny involved and maybe some kind of quality checks before being approved. i know there is plenty of ugly artwork but i would always have expected it to be accurate. anyway i guess it doesnt really matter at the end of the day, i will figure a way to change it. thanks


Yeah but you have to consider the whole process, how does it work in the real world not in theory.

I've seen this, I know how human nature is, generally a person with the power to sign off on projects will never hire someone they see as a threat to their creativity or position, ie someone who could one day take their place.

It's a job first their very livelihood, they don't care as much about "the project" as they do about "their job" and keeping it, and remember that is the person who hires all the people who work on each project under their direction...

Now that is how bad a project gets completed, then it will be approved by a group probably but understand this is a "business" and changing things costs money and no one likes re-works or re-do's, so even if someone points out little issues that need correcting, unless the person/people who hold the purse strings (might be non-technical and non-artistic or both) agrees it's worth doing, then it may end up getting pushed out with known errors or issues...

People tend to forget all studios are in it for the money and they hate losing money for any reason, that includes fixing things they know are not correct or look bad even.

There is also the fact that artists often take liberties on purpose like that might have looked better in the first pass and then some jerk from marketing who knows zip about art says we need the main star bigger, so they make him bigger in-spite of what it does to the look, happens all the time.

I've been involved in projects where creative decisions were made by those with none becasue they were in positions of power and they had non-creative reason's, generally monetary driven, for the way they wanted things to be done...


:)
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Re: Braveheart

Postby chouette » Jun Wed 19, 2019 11:02 pm

And yet, you would think they should at least have half a brain and know that a nice layout (like covers) is what helps sell the product.
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Re: Braveheart

Postby ctaulbee » Jun Thu 20, 2019 2:06 pm

They don't always get it wrong, like here is that same image of him properly positioned, notice how he is closer and even bigger but becasue the scene behind him is higher, near his waist, it all looks in proportion now.

This was likely made by different people too, generally the same person does not make all the posters for a given release anyway.




Worth noting too and I didn't check as I don't care enough to research it, that poster where he is too big might not even be a studio poster anyway.  There is a lot of fan made crap floating around the web that people think is studio work when in fact it's something someone made at home, just like a custom cover.

Also small release groups who release little batches of special edition Blu-ray or steel-books etc they just get whoever they can to make art for it, could be anyone.
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Re: Braveheart

Postby Nickaberdeen » Jun Fri 21, 2019 3:49 pm

sorry for the delay, after some advice and assistance i have gone in a different direction with the cover. heres the newest update:



i think it is an improvement, its still a little rough as i havent decided on a background yet. been working mainly on the front image. if anyone has any advice feel free. cheers
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Re: Braveheart

Postby topmeasure » Jun Fri 21, 2019 4:34 pm

Nice start Nick, I like that image.
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Re: Braveheart

Postby chouette » Jun Fri 21, 2019 5:21 pm

This new image is a big improvement from your first 2, although I prefer something like CT posted mainly because you can see the weapon in Mel Gibson's hand and the background is nice, except for those two love birds on the top left, lol
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Re: Braveheart

Postby ctaulbee » Jun Sat 22, 2019 12:26 am

Looking good bud, if you're going with the white BG which I like by the way, you could drop the saturation some on your images and make the hue a little more red like +2 to 3 or so just a little, something like this maybe?

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Re: Braveheart

Postby Nickaberdeen » Jun Sat 22, 2019 8:49 am

ctaulbee wrote:Looking good bud, if you're going with the white BG which I like by the way, you could drop the saturation some on your images and make the hue a little more red like +2 to 3 or so just a little, something like this maybe?


i do like the white (and i like it more with the satuaration dropped) but because its scotland i definitely feel like i need some grey clouds in there, i think it would look more authentic.
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Re: Braveheart

Postby bankska22 » Jun Sat 22, 2019 11:30 am

Love the new direction.
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Re: Braveheart

Postby ctaulbee » Jun Sat 22, 2019 11:40 am

Some light clouds could work OK in there, another thing you could do if you wanted would be inset a small action shot at the bottom.

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Re: Braveheart

Postby Nickaberdeen » Jun Sat 22, 2019 2:47 pm

so i have changed the saturation of front, im not sure on if i will do more on the front or not, wanted to get started on the back in the hopes that will give me clarity on whether to add a background or not as i do quite like the front but we'll see how it goes.

so on the back i have gone a bit random and nothing like i have done before but i quite like it. im not sure it will meet the general rules of how to do it but just let me know if i need to add or change anything.

the next part will be a little more difficult as i usually struggle with the back so any pointers will be welcome. here is where it stands at the moment:

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